Looking for the Opinions on PRINCE2 Training Orgs in London?

This forum is for members to share and gain knowledge of Project Management. Got a question about project management? Need help with a problem? Wish to offer tips and advice? Post here.
bmsmith
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Hi I'm new here,

I am looking at getting myself all trained up from scratch and prince2 is the best place to start if I want to get into project work. I have looked through a vast list of training organisations around london using this list
http://www.prince-officialsite.com/Trai ... ngA-E.aspx

The prices seem to vary from around £500 to £3500!! that's a big difference. I have read the testimonials on their sites but i tend to be a bit sceptical of such things. So I figured for an honest and unbiased opinion to ask here. Can anyone recommend a good one for around £800?

I appreciate your views.

Brian
satisfactionuk
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hI,
I agree that Prince2 does seem to be the best project management system along with the AIPM qualification however I would not go rushing in to a course just yet. My advice is to go onto Amazon and buy copies of the course material and study that first. Only when your absolutely confident that you can pass the exam witharound 75 to 80 percent would I then suggest that you fork out money on the course.

If your already a project manager then you probably already know most of the supplementary recommended reading, if your a complete newbie then you will be just starting on a very long road of discovery and you have a great deal of learning to do in numerous areas of business.

If you go to the business book review section of this forum you will gain some idea of the topics that you will need to cover to become a competent project manager, and believe me, that will only be the start.

If you are hell bent on doing prince2 then you will also need to learn some software packages and I recommend MS Project as your project scheduling tool with Palisades @Risk for projects to do your risk management task and Project in a Box package to do your configuration management tasks.

These three tools make a formidable combination.

There is absolutely no point in studying the project management system whether it be PMI, AMP or Prince 2 or even the Australian AIPM if you have not studied and have a good working knowledge of the other basic stuff outlined in those books that I recommended.

So my recommendation is to set yourself a goal for say one or two years time, then get as many books as you can on a wide variety of subject areas and study them until you are confident that you know what your doing. Then when your fully prepared, go for it one hundred percent and get your qualifications. Doing it this way, you will not be disappointed and your boss will be delighted at your effort.

What you don’t want to do is spend a lot of money on a course and then fail or get a minimum pass and then find yourself struggling on your first project.
Kind Regards

Stephan Toth
bmsmith
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Thanks for the quick response. As it goes I am not doing this through an employee. I'm doing this off my own back as I am about to be unemployed due to contractor cutbacks so really I need this to update my skills. That's why cost really matters.

You are absolutely right, it's best to take time and read books on the fundamentals and business background. Initially I would prefer Project support work as opposed to actually managing a project. This will allow me to learn how to manage a project at the same time whilst putting Prince2 in practice. That is if I find an employer willing to take me on whilst learning it. Learning this is going to be a project in itself.

I will have a look over the books that are suggested on this site. There is a world of information here.

I have been involved in projects before so that's a head start.
simonbuehring
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Hi Brian

I highly recommend taking the PRINCE2 Practitioner exam because this is the qualification that most employers are seeking in their job candidates, whether for project manager roles or project support roles. Project management is not rocket science, and in my opinion is mainly common sense. In practice, most organizations do not actually use PRINCE2, even though they might have funded their employees to do the training. Taking the course however, would allow you to talk the talk so to speak. In terms of applying it, if the organization does not use PRINCE2, the project manager would, in my opinion, greatly benefit from applying elements of PRINCE2 (e.g. managing risks and changes) to their project.

You asked for an unbiased opinion. Mine is biased because I work for an ATO (Knowledge Train) in London which does offer Foundation & Practitioner courses. We have some deals on right now for £795 if you want to take a look at the http://www.knowledgetrain.co.uk/prince2 ... tioner.php page. (Don't get confused with the name of another PRINCE2 training company that uses a very similar name as ours). As one of the trainers, we take great pride in regularly attaining very high pass rates in the Practitioner exam. Over the last 18 months, students who have studied the 5 day courses with us have achieved pass rates 13% higher than the national average. If you view the testimonials on our site, these all come from previous students.

There are cheaper options from other ATO's which appear too good to be true. If it looks too good to be true, then it probably is.

Good luck.
ThePRINCE2Coach
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Here is a full copy of our PRINCE2 Foundation Training Manual (Evaluation version) we look forward to your feedback.

Link: http://www.prince2-ug.be/foundation-manual

This book makes it very easy to prepare for a PRINCE2 Foundation course or the PRINCE2 Foundation Exam. Thanks for any feedback (frank.turley@mgmtplaza.com)
bmsmith
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sorry for the delay. busy times. Thanks all for you're advice.

PRINCE2 is on my list. thanks for the PDF link. I've tried all my local shops and libraries. None of which have any books on PRINCE2 at all!!

by the way I can't seem to open that pdf manual.

Is it also worth doing a course on Agile?
satisfactionuk
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Hi, you can get all of the Prince2 books and process maps from Amazon at great prices. Just make sure that you really study them well before signing up for a course and the exams.

Ideally, you can consider yourself not ready for the course and exams if you cannot draw the process map completely off by heart.

Also remember that even if you qualify for Prince 2 that will not make you a proficient project manager.

There is a whole host of additional reading to do on a wide variety of subjects.

For instance, each process flags up certain key skill sets that are needed to complete the function. It is up to you to decide if you are weak, moderate or strong in these areas and to take on the appropriate study to bring your skills up to the required standard.

In any case, you will find the study challenging and rewarding so good luck and don't blame me for your long sleepless nights studying lol.
Kind regards

Stephan Toth
TeamPM
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Hi Everyone

I will begin by declaring my interest up front. I am the Lead Trainer and Managing Director of Team PM, a PRINCE2 Accredited Training Organisation.

At the moment there is a great deal of change occurring in the Project Management training market, and this change is greatest in the PRINCE2 Accredited Training Market. The change relates in the main to the prices that are being charged by training organisations. This reduction in prices is confusing because we always suspect that "You get what you pay for..." In the case of PRINCE2 this is no longer the case. The main difference in price is margin and the cost of advertising.

As a buyer of PRINCE2 training there are some fundamental questions that you should be asking the vendor of the training product.

The first question is "Are you an ATO (Accredited Training Organisation), are you an Affiliate of an ATO, or are you reselling an ATO originated course?" Only a PRINCE2 ATO can offer accredited training and the Foundation and Practitioner examinations. The status of ATO is awarded to organisations and courses that APMG - the accrediting body - determines are able to deliver appropriate training and customer service to delegates.

The next question relates to class numbers. Of course, the higher the number of delegates in the room, the lower the per capita cost of the training and the higher the margin for the ATO even at lower prices.

Try asking whether the vendor runs "self-scan" in-classroom scanning of Practitioner exam papers. A few ATOs will be able to offer this service which means that the delegate can have a provisional (99% accurate) view of their exam result within an hour of the end of the Practitioner exam. This is useful if you need your result for a promotion or new position, or you are just nervous and impatient! Official results take around 10 days to arrive in most cases.

One question that is less useful is "What is your pass rate?" The reason is that there is no official badge or certificate that offers this information. In essence, a training organisation can invent a number and there is no way of proving or disproving the figure. They know that you probably won't pursue proof anyway. We always tell delegates to focus on their personal performance during the week rather than the statistical performance of the ATO or trainer over a number of years. After all, every class and every delegate is different. Interestingly, as many PRINCE2 trainers are freelance you may find a trainer working for a high price vendor one week and a low price vendor the next!

As a last remark, and moving full circle to the initial question, I recommend that delegates don't consider price as an indication of quality. Focus instead on the level or service you receive from the organisation when you are on the phone with them, the information about course numbers and the information they are able to offer about the training environment. Also important are the pre- and post-course support that is offered.

I will be pleased to offer advice to anyone contemplating a PRINCE2 training course, whether with Team PM or another ATO and I promise I will try to be as unbiased as I can.

Cameron Stewart
Team PM
0800 756 6666
PM tension
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I've been using the Knowledgetrain online training package:

http://www.prince2-online.co.uk

PRINCE2 Online Foundation & Practitioner bundle plus exams PR09GB £696 incl VAT

It is my best option as I'm overseas and wanted to be able to work towards my qualifications in downtime, but didn't want to lose precious UK leave time.

On the Plus side- It downloaded easily and quickly, it ties in very well with the OGC manual, its well structured and broken down into segments reflecting the seven themes and seven processes with a few extra parts.

On the downside Its a very new product, its not been thoroughly tested I have found seven mistakes in it so far, most stemming from inadequate proof reading and testing, I've given up reporting the errors to them, I'm now considering postponing my exams and attending a UK based course.

As an aside they charge £109 for the OGC manual, try Amazon for £52
JayatKT
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I have been greatly involved in the development of the elearning course at Knowledge Train and I may have spoken with "PM tension". Once again thank you for providing your feedbacks about our eLearning course.

In order to serve the main purpose of the product which is to facilitate the understanding of PRINCE2 methodology, this elearning product has a great focus on course content and structure. I should therefore say that "PM tension" has been absolutely right about the plus side of the course.

The course has been fully accredited by APMG UK, which means the course was fully assessed by APMG and had passed their thorough tests. However as with every other IT related product, it is almost impossible to guarantee that the very first version of the product is free from all flaws. With this understanding we have always welcomed feedback from our customers and ensured that the feedbacks are dealt with as prompt as possible. We are also pleased to know that the errors being reported, including the 3 errors reported from one of our customers, are all minor errors that would by no means affect the credibility of the product. The errors have been recorded and will be included in the next update which is scheduled for release in the next 2 weeks..

I should also explain that the price of £109 for the manual includes international postage. In fact, we always recommend our overseas customers to obtain a copy of the manual locally.

We have received a lot of great feedback about the course and the overall exam success rate with our elearning course is exceptionally high. We are very pleased to have brought the product to our customers and are committed to making it the best PRINCE2 elearning product in the UK. If you are interested in learning more about the product, please feel free to contact us. Our contact details are available on our website: http://www.prince2-online.co.uk
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